Mossberg pump, Taurus Judge or S&W .357. Good options for home defense in most cases, but not if you are this guy…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYFXlqrj3oI
Neighbors who live in the Lakewood Grove subdivision in Tomball are on edge after a violent home invasion in the community overnight on Monday.
The homeowner and suspects fired back and forth more than a dozen times, according to Precinct 4 deputy constables.
Investigators say it was just after midnight, the homeowner was alone and asleep but woke up when his front door was kicked in. The homeowner saw his front door kicked in, but had a weapon on him.
Assistant Chief Mark Herman said, “The homeowner ended up in fear for his life. He discharged his weapon multiple times. The suspects returned fire. We haven’t confirmed anyone was hit.”
I think we can all agree that if he was armed with a shotgun or 6 shot revolver he very well could have been at a disadvantage given the scenario. Some will argue shot placement vs spray and pray methodology but I don’t think any of us are aware of the dynamics of the actual event and I’m quite surprised (should I be?) at the willingness of the intruders to “shoot it out” with the homeowner.
In any event I know that I’m content having multiple options at my disposal which would allow me to stay in the fight should something like this occur. Do you?
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After almost 4 decades in LE, I advise friends to arm themselves with multiple choices. Start with a handgun that you know, not one you buy, load and make ready and place on the nightstand. Practice with everything that you own.
Have a backup, whether it is another handgun or in my case, a shotgun.
I also keep 2 spare magazines within reach, just in case.
Have taught the wife to start with her handgun and then reach out for HER shotgun and have it available if needed; just like I do.
In our case, if the dogs don’t bark to the noise at the door, the alarm will immediately sound and we go into the defensive position.
I always tell folks to let the bad guys come to them and to keep a good sight pattern on the bedroom door.
I have gone with the times and switched to an auto with a rail which has a light. Once the perp is in the door, they are bought and paid for.
Forgot, call the cops first, put the phone on speakerphone and set it on the bed during the confrontation; just another way of CYA.
Nice article.
Personally, I have both, but they are a secondary line of defense. My first is a rather burly and fiercely protective dog. In close quarters, I will let him do his job and back him up.
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Maj and I were discussing this the other night, wondering if the dog could actually be a hindrance. I know that I would not hesitate if my dog were “in the mix” with a couple perps, if he catches a round or two that would be sad and not intentional but people > animals. I wonder if my wife would be the same way or if she would hesitate.
I look at it this way, as well: bad guy is going to be a lot more nervous at the sound of a pissed off and growly large dog as opposed to someone saying they called the cops or that they were armed, etc. I would hate it if he got hit but an 80+ pound dog hitting you and grabbing something tender is definitely going to distract you for a few seconds, time enough for a person to capitalize on it.
His main function is to sound pissed off and make the bad guy look elsewhere for a target (another home). I think good dog can be just as influential as a good gun in a bad situation, in my opinion.
I had the privilege of working with K9 units when I served in Military Police and have seen what a well trained dog can do as far as taking the fight out of someone simply by being there.
While we all consider him family, he has a job to do and has demonstrated he isnt afraid to do it. He is my home security partner, the first round fired, so to speak.
As far as how the other family feels on this, wife is on board. Daughter, am pretty sure she would hesitate but her E&E if she is alone is to head out the back, grabbing my handgun on the way out and heading to neighbor’s.
To make a long story short, I am like you in this, I would hate to see him hurt but would hate more that it was wife or kid.
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Totally with you J, agree on ALL points….just wanted to introduce another aspect of the conversation. When I went to check out my boy at 5 weeks old I pulled up to the breeder’s home (deep in the sticks). There was a wrap around porch where two massive German Shepherds roamed back and forth, once I got out of the car they did so and barked/snarled. Talk about almost staining my pants. I waited until I was invited in before even approaching the house. A good dog really does make a difference.
yea, from previous conversations I know we are of a similar mindset concerning this subject.
RHC has the right idea up there. Layers of defense and you ambush.
Yes, I like options. I also have multiple to arm those around me too. From my bedroom I could fire about 70 rounds without reloading. Bad times if thats needed. Plus I have several mags for each and boxes of ammo to top off with.
I don’t discount shotguns, plus they can have extensions and hold up to 10 shells. Add in some combat reloads and one could stay in the fight for a good long time. I wouldn’t stake my life on combat reloads in the middle of the night, because I’m not that proficient. Some people are.
I am surprised he stayed to slug it out too. I think thats like the one percent of one percent type of break in there. You never know whats coming though, if you’re in that one percent situation it happened to you more than you want it to.
We could criticize this home owner for missing, but we don’t know what was going on and he lived to tell the tell so he and his fire arm selection did ok.
here is a question pertaining to shotguns, what type of load does everyone prefer for home defense? I know a. lot of people go for the old 00 buck standby, but I would submit an alternative for discussion for a couple of reasons, namely frame houses and nearby neighbors. buckshot can cut through a wall or 2 rather easily. I tend to lean more for a heavy game load, like #4 duck loads. you get a lot of spread and not so much risk of endangering neighbors. A home invasion scenario is going to put you at 12 -15 feet or less in most cases and this type of load will do a LOT of damage at this range.
thoughts?
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I have 00 Buck, slug and game loads on standby.
I wouldn’t want to get hit with a heavy game load. I have kept turkey loads in mine in the past.
We played around with pistol rounds and how many sheets of drywall they’d go through. Never did it with shotguns though.
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No doubt, who wants to get shot with a game load? Not this guy
I forgot to say it’s loaded with slugs at the moment with turkey loads on the saddle.
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Good to have multiple options, with respect to what is in the gun and in the saddle
Personally I use a “step up” first 2 rounds #7.5 bird shot. 2 rounds #4 shot.2 rounds 00. Than 2 rounds “slug” finished up with 2 rounds hollow pointed hunting loads. Ohhh and a #7.5 in the pipe to start. Gata just love a 10 round shotgun.
I love the ten round option since I dont train the reloads enough. I used to stagger the rounds. Then I split them up so I know for sure whats coming out I guess, this is where I waste a lot of thought. Just load it and if need be shoot it until they stop attacking is the philosophy I’m using now.
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Shoot until the threat is stopped. Always a good philosophy.
The idea of reloading a shotgun during a firefight is not one I would like. You lose to much time and concentration IMO. Like you Echo I don’t practice reloading enough. I’m more of a pull trigger till it goes click (or the threat stops) and grab another weapon. Usually the DX45 (14 rounds is nice). I just hope like heck I never have to use any of them. Although the 10 round shotgun makes a hell of a duck gun LOL I really encourage practicing with multiple firearms at the same shoot. IE shotgun/rifle/sidearm. Just to get used to different “in house” scenarios. I do a “cowboy shoot” with all 3, not really as easy as it looks. But it is fun to smoke up the place with Black Powder HAHAHA.
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I think where the issue lies is that we are drifting past the concept that a shotgun is good enough for home defense, a strongly held belief and truth be told still probably a reality in most instances. How many people believe that just working the action on a shotgun would scare a thief away, or squeezing off a few bursts of 00 buck. Clearly I’d like to think that would be enough but against armed and determined (to live) criminals it probably wouldn’t be. Criminals like to live too, and if they are armed you’d best believe they will probably fire back if fired upon. Even with a well trained homeowner, 2-1 or 3-1 odds strongly favor the bad guys with guns. Not trying to rain on anyone’s parade as I think we are all on the same page, but even the best laid home defense plans are vulnerable.
I think you bring up a good point here. in a home invasion situation, let’s face it, there is very little in the way of effective cover. walls tend to be paper thin and couches only stop bullets in movies.
In all honesty, I think E&E is about the only realistic option, especially if there are multiple invaders. True, having a weapon can help unless you get drawn into a fight. bullets meant for you can just as easily find loved ones, even hiding in another room.
Nothing I have is worth that. yes, if I have to, I can and will lay it down to the best of my abilities, but ONLY if there is no choice. i have a shotgun and a couple of revolvers, not so much out of any particular loyalty to revolvers but they are most comfortable to the wife and daughter.
before getting them involved, though, I would do everything possible to get them out of harms way.
well, the dog and I would do that.
Training transitions is always good. I don’t know how often that would be practical in the civilian world, but hopefully none of its ever needed. Makes us feel better about ourselves anyways lol. Would have to be a rabbid mob to walk through ten rounds of 12 gauge and keep coming.
Echo. You have seen the rabbid riots at Walmart on black friday right? Not a nice thing to think about.
Yes I have seen them. I’ve seen swarms of rioters recently as well. Crazy stuff does happen. Home invasions tend to involve multiple invaders and often start with a knock at the door. I agree, train for the worst and stay prepared.
Not saying a dog is a bad idea, just that you have got to consider the entire scenario and most owners will hesitate before taking a shot if there is a chance they will hit the dog. Just human nature.
As for a home invasion with multiple armed individuals, it probably is not going to end well for the homeowner and short of laying an arsenal out before bed every night, there will always be the chance you will be outgunned.
I echo the postings of RHC, at the top of these posts. His counsel is spot on, in my personal and professional experience. I served in law enforcement in Southern California, and have now fled my once native state for good reasons. Keeping Dispatch on the cell phone is CRITICAL to making sure YOUR version is the correct one. Having a recording of what YOU are discussing with the Dispatcher, while the patrol units are en route, is critical to establishing that you are definitely the “victim”.Besides, it always good for the Public Defender to hear their clients on the tapes, telling their intended victims what they are planning on doing to them, or the sounds of their predatory actions are. Juries seem to convict at a much high rate in my experience when the intended victim is clearly heard on tape trying to protect themselves from the predators. Excellent article and great posts.
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TPS
Thanks for the insight, good thinking points for sure. It’s always good to have documentation of some form.
I agree with all the comments above and in addition I believe a crossbow gives you the element of surprise and will stop anyone in their tracks and
their fellow cruds will not know what happened nor where the sudden take down came from
Maybe a ‘bullet-resistant’ ‘safe’ room is what you need. Short of a SHTF situation, you probably would be in a fire fight for very long, no one with half a brain wants to be shot. If in a SHTF situation, then set up the claymore mines at every entrance and have the power washer ready to clean off the walls, ceiling and floor!
I use a Mossberg pump loaded with #4 bird shot, up close its lethal and wont over penetrate and injure/kill my neighbor.
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